Chamber and committees

Auditor General, will you comment on the fact that the senior finance person—the head of finance—does not sit at director level? There are four directors, but there is no director of finance. Is that unusual in an organisation such as this?

The wider-scope audit report suggests that the lack of itemised receipts related to “business entertaining costs”. What constitutes such costs?

The framework document, which was last reviewed in April 2022—in other words, at the start of the period—contains a section on gifts and hospitality, although I think that that relates to the board of directors rather than to staff. It covers the circumstances under which people need to record accepting or receiving gifts and so on; it does not cover giving gifts and hospitality. What is the policy on giving those versus receiving them? Were some of those expenses incurred by board members, or did the chief executive incur almost half of them, or more than that, while the rest were incurred by other members of staff?

Before we leave the question of governance, what role do you see for, and what part has been played by, the board? When I look at the audit and risk committee’s list of responsibilities, it includes

“the strategic processes for risk, control and governance ... adequacy of management response to issues identified by audit activity, including external audit”,

and

“the effectiveness of the internal control environment”.

Has it measured up to its responsibilities?

Is there a transparency issue here in relation to, first of all, the previous point about what contact was made between the executive directors, non-executive directors and the chair of the board, which the deputy convener referred to, and the Scottish Government? Is that in the public domain? Is it possible to understand what form that took?

Secondly, in quite a number of the answers to the deputy convener’s earlier questions about the role of the board and so on, you said that we do not know what the board knew when, but the board publishes minutes, does it not? Is there a transparency issue that the minutes of the board do not sufficiently represent what was discussed at board meetings?

The second item on the agenda is also a decision to take business in private. Do members agree to consider any future draft report on adult mental health in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Agenda item 3 is consideration of the Auditor General for Scotland’s section 22 report on “The 2022-23 audit of the Water Industry Commission for Scotland”. I welcome to the meeting our three witnesses: Stephen Boyle, Auditor General for Scotland, who is joined this morning by Carole Grant, audit director, and Richard Smith, senior audit manager, from Audit Scotland.

We have quite a number of questions to put to you on the section 22 report, Auditor General, but before we get to them, I invite you to make a short opening statement.

Was the issue one of a lack of “itemised receipts” and the purchase of alcohol “exceeding the approval rates” in claims made by the former chief executive, or was this sort of thing more widespread through the organisation?

That is helpful. I think that Graham Simpson wants to come in on that point.

Okay. I invite the deputy convener to put some questions to you.