Chamber and committees

I ask Peter Lynas to respond on the same question about definitions.

I think that we are out of time, unless Pam Duncan-Glancy, who indicated earlier that she wanted to come in, is still very keen to do so. Are you, Pam?

We will now hear from our third panel. The witnesses, both of whom are joining us virtually, will be able to speak to us more about how other jurisdictions are addressing conversion therapy practices.

I welcome to the meeting Dr Christine Ryan, senior legal adviser to the United Nations special rapporteur on freedom of religion or belief; and Dr Adam Jowett, associate head, school of psychological, social and behavioural sciences, Coventry University. Dr Jowett is the lead author of UK Government-commissioned research into conversion therapy.

I invite the witnesses to make short opening statements.

Welcome to the eighth meeting in session 6 of the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee. No apologies have been received.

The first agenda item is to agree whether to take in private items 6 and 7, which are consideration of today’s evidence on a petition and consideration of our work programme. Are we agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

The next item on our agenda is consideration of two affirmative instruments: the draft Equality Act 2010 (Specific Duties) (Scotland) Amendment Regulations 2021 and the draft Equality Act 2010 (Specification of Public Authorities) (Scotland) Order 2021.

I welcome to the meeting Ivan McKee, who is the Minister for Business, Trade, Tourism and Enterprise, and his officials, who are joining us virtually. Pamela Berry is team leader for South of Scotland Enterprise sponsorship in the directorate for economic development, and Jennifer Singerman is a solicitor in the Scottish Government legal directorate.

I refer members to paper 1 and I invite the minister to make opening remarks on both instruments.

Let me probe the issue again. Are you saying that if a gay member of an evangelical church, say, were to come forward, it would be okay for a therapy or practice to proceed that had the intention of making that person straight—to use plain English?

John and Peter would like to respond. Please try to keep it short because we are running well over time.

We will now hear from our second panel of witnesses, who will give a short presentation on the legislation that operates in Australia.

I welcome to the meeting our witnesses, who join us virtually. They are: Nathan Despott, who is on the steering committee of the Brave Network and an honorary research fellow at La Trobe University in Melbourne; and Dr Timothy Jones, associate professor at La Trobe University. I apologise for the slightly late start, which will affect them more than it does us. We are delighted that they are both able to join us and I hand over to Nathan Despott.

I thank Timothy Jones and Nathan Despott very much. That was really helpful and useful, and covered a wide range of topics. I fear that it would not be possible to do justice to the evidence that you have given us by asking questions now. I therefore wonder whether it is okay with members that we do not do that but consider some of the evidence—the documents that relate to Nathan’s presentation will be published on the Scottish Parliament’s website—and, if we have any questions, write to both witnesses on the specifics. That would give us a bit more time to consider the range of evidence that you have provided.

I say a huge thank you to the witnesses for giving us their time. I know that it is very late in Australia just now.

I suspend the meeting briefly, before the next evidence session.

As there are no questions for the minister, we move on to item 3, which is consideration of the motion on recommending approval of the instrument.

Motion moved,

That the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee recommends that the First-tier Tribunal for Scotland (Chambers) Amendment Regulations 2021 [draft] be approved—[Ash Regan].

Motion agreed to.