Chamber and committees

One of the lessons that came across loud and clear—not just in this part of Government, but in other parts—was a wish for longer-term guarantees of funding in order to allow better longer-term planning. That was understandable, and it particularly came across from headteachers who wanted to plan out the PEF part of the Scottish attainment challenge funding. I was very cognisant of that and we were pleased to be able to deliver it. It will allow schools and local authorities to do more long-term planning and ensure that there is a bit more continuity—for example, in the staff who are there for young people.

At the individual school level, there is the school improvement plan work. Parents and indeed young people should play an important part in that. We should not forget the importance of listening to young people as part of that work. In the national setting, we are very keen to ensure that the voice of parents comes through in different parts of policy right across education. We have connections at both official and ministerial levels with parents’ groups and we hear directly from them. They also play an important part in the Scottish education council, which ensures that they are involved.

Although teachers know their young people best and we should have an empowered system, part of a headteacher’s work is to take account of parents’ views as they deliver school improvement work, and I think that that is to everyone’s benefit.

I appreciate that there are different measures that we could use, but I have explained the reason why we decided to stay with PEF. I have also explained that I decided to change other parts of the system in recognition of the fact that poverty exists right across Scotland. The fact that we are not using the Scottish index of multiple deprivation, or not using a bid process, which is what has happened before, allowed us to look at children and low-income families who needed help right across Scotland, including in rural areas.

I am very happy to meet the constituents that Oliver Mundell has in mind to discuss that. He can send me the details. The Scottish Government is putting in support to assist with Ukrainian children and young people who come here. It will be a difficult time of year to enter the education system, and that will understandably impact on what can be done in the academic year. A great deal of work is being done by local authorities and individual schools to support particular families, because every circumstance will be different. If there is a role that I or Education Scotland can play in smoothing any of that over, we will be pleased to do so.

Education Scotland has put in national resources to assist with Ukrainian students and families who are coming over and moving into the system. There is a lot more in the discussion about what we are doing in education to support Ukrainian nationals, but with the time constraints I am happy to deal with those questions offline.

We knew that we were making an impact because of the statistics that I read out to the member earlier, but we knew that we had to do more and that there were areas in which we still needed to improve, which is exactly why we have had a refresh. I will certainly not sit here and say that everything pre-pandemic was going at the pace or with the urgency that we would have liked. That is exactly why we have refreshed the system.

I point Bob Doris to two aspects of the impact of Covid. One is the equity audit that took place some time ago, which looked at and reported back on the impact of Covid. The other is the most recent ACEL statistics, which showed a dip in attainment. It is very difficult to draw a direct correlation between one thing happening and any impact on attainment, but I do not think it would be stretching the bounds too much to say that, during the past couple of years, Covid has impacted on attainment. That was clearly shown in the equity audit.

The context that Mr Doris points to is exceptionally important and will be taken account of as Education Scotland works with local authorities on the stretch aims. The context of every local authority will be taken into account and, as we develop our policies, we will always ensure that we analyse the impact of those policies once we evaluate.

It is very difficult to point to one policy correlating directly to a change in outcomes, but it is clear that the more that we can do to tackle child poverty, for example, the more we will be able to help families in their overall circumstances, and the more that will help with attainment. Likewise, if decisions such as the £20 cut to universal credit that Mr Doris pointed to are taken elsewhere, they will have negative consequences for families and will inevitably impact on how they cope. We will endeavour to look at and take account of the impact of different policies and understand that context as we move forward once local authorities have developed the stretch aims.

We need the ability to say that, for example, one campus in an institution might have to close with the exceptions that can be made for—again I give the most obvious example—animal welfare, but there are other possible areas. We might come to a different point in the pandemic at which we need to say that an institution should remain on online learning, except if someone has to go in for practical assessment, and we would discuss with the universities when people are required to be on campus.

We would always take the partnership approach that we have always taken to those things, but we still need that full stop that allows the Government to take decisions if an institution is taking a different approach on aspects of public health.

In saying that, and as I have said on numerous occasions, if aspects of the granular detail are causing concerns, I am more than happy to work with Universities Scotland on them.

On the points about additional support needs, one of the important aspects of the bill is ensuring educational continuity, rather than having blanket closures. One of the reasons for that is our recognition that young people will be impacted differently, although they are all impacted. The caveat around those with additional support needs is a prime example of the importance of recognising that.

Involving young people in decision making in an integral way is key. We are keen to do that within educational policy as a whole. We are also cognisant that we must do that correctly. I pay tribute to the individuals who have taken part in the coronavirus education recovery group and the national qualifications 2021-22 group. It is very challenging for one young person to come into a committee surrounded by education professionals—that is a challenging environment. We need to bear in mind that, although young people should be at the table in such discussions, that needs to be supported and facilitated in a way that makes a genuine difference.

In those formal structures, we must ensure that, as we begin to develop policy, young people are in there right from the start of the process. We are working with young people on that to ensure that they feel that we are doing that in the most effective way, rather than the Government coming up with the way to do that.

I have already talked about the lawfulness of the bill, the Presiding Officer’s statement and the discussions that we have had to date about our human rights obligations. I am really sorry if Mr Mundell thinks that we are wasting Parliament’s time by talking about how to deal with a further public health emergency. However, that is for him, not me, to reflect on. One of the biggest obligations that the Government and the Parliament have is to protect our people, and that is what the Government is attempting to do with the bill. If Mr Mundell does not think that Parliament should do that, he is more than welcome to speak about that in Parliament. However, if that is the Scottish Conservatives’ point, that is deeply disappointing. We all have an obligation to work out how we, as a country, can best deal with a public health emergency. If Mr Mundell thinks that that is a waste of parliamentary time, that is up to him.

I fully appreciate the point that came up on that subject, as well as the point about the wait for the public inquiry. In response to that, again, we want to learn lessons from the coronavirus, and one of the criticisms of the Scottish and UK Governments was that we were not ready for the public health emergency when it came.

With the greatest respect for those who think that we should wait for the inquiry, I do not know when the next public health emergency will arise or whether we will have another wave of coronavirus that will impact deeply on education. It would be remiss of, and inappropriate for, any Government to wait and hope that nothing happened until the public inquiry finished. I completely understand the view that we should take more time and wait for the public inquiry, but we do not know the timeframe for that, and we will still have to go through the work after it concludes. I would summarise the situation by saying that we do not have the luxury of that gap. We cannot just cross our fingers and hope that nothing happens in the meantime that requires us to have the powers that are in this bill or—if Parliament feels that the bill is not right—whatever bill we have at the end of the process.