Chamber and committees

I recognise that issue, particularly with regard to the young carer grant and the carer support payment. As I said, we are very keen to keep that under review, and we will work with stakeholders on it.

With regard to the aspects around young carers, I mentioned in a previous answer to Mr Balfour some of the support that is already available, but I will give some examples of the support that can be accessed. There is the education maintenance allowance, and households with 16 to 19-year-olds in non-advanced education can continue to get support from reserved benefits such as child benefit, universal credit and child tax credits. There is support out there.

As I said, the education maintenance allowance is available only in Scotland. That is an important aspect of the wider support for our young people that sits outside social security. Again, I stress that we need to look at the issues in the round as we continue to develop the system. We need to consider what sits in social security and what sits elsewhere, and what is still reserved, and we will continue to work to see whether anything more needs to be done in that area.

I hope that the committee is reassured that there is still support out there for young people who are in full-time school education.

Those who have been involved in discussions on social security will have heard my predecessors and me talk a lot about the importance of safe and secure transition. We are right to do that, because we recognise that these individuals, who might be in very difficult or vulnerable situations, are relying on payments. So, one of our first responsibilities is to ensure that we have a safe and secure transition. That is why case transfer is very important.

We must also ensure that we do not have a two-tier system in which the rules are different for those who are making new applications and those who are already in the system and are still waiting for case transfer. That is a very unfair situation to be in.

That situation means that we cannot deliver some of the changes that we would like to make as fast as people would like—I totally recognise that—but I think that, as we heard last week, many of the witnesses and stakeholders have stressed the overall importance of safe and secure transition.

The issue of overpayments is a really important one. There are still things that we can do to improve the situation and to minimise the risk of overpayments. That has been a long-standing concern about carers allowance, which sits within the Department for Work and Pensions.

I will give a few examples that might help the committee. One of the areas in which we are keen to do more than the DWP currently does is the averaging of earnings to provide carers with more stable support. Incomes can go up or down, so we want earnings to be averaged over a period. That will, I hope, make it less likely that people will find the eligibility criteria out of reach because of, for example, a bonus or overtime at a particular time. Averaging is very important.

We have built in a system of alerts that Social Security Scotland will use to get data from His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs to track carers’ earnings, and there will be a number of scheduled reviews of earnings for self-employed carers, to prevent there being as many overpayments.

One more example—this is an important area on which the committee took a lot of evidence last week—is the fact that we will pay the carer support payment four-weekly in arrears. That is different from the DWP’s payment of three weeks in arrears and one week in advance, which can sometimes make it difficult to make the analysis as tight as it needs to be under carers allowance.

We are still keeping to safe and secure transition, but those are some of the measures that we are looking at in relation to the carer support payment that, I hope, can still make a difference to people with regard to the risk of overpayments.

We are looking at options for introducing a formal right of appeal for the liability of overpayments. Carers can, of course, request a review of a decision on liability of overpayments, but that will be carried out by Social Security Scotland. I appreciate that stakeholders have raised concerns about the fact that there is no formal redetermination or appeal rights, as you said.

That is an issue that we need to look at not just in relation to the carer support payment but across all devolved benefits. The committee will be aware that we, as a Government, have consulted on overpayment liability. The committee will also be aware that we have said in the programme for government that there will be a social security amendment bill later this parliamentary year. Full details of how we will approach that will be in the bill.

I hope that that provides the committee with reassurance that we have already undertaken consultation on the issue, that we recognise that it is an issue and that the committee and the Parliament will have the opportunity to look at the proposed solutions once the bill is before Parliament.

Again, that cannot be done until after case transfer. I gave details earlier—for the sake of time, I will not go through them again—about how we are trying to get better at looking at average earnings. We are also looking at how, if someone goes over the income threshold, their award will be temporarily stopped and reinstated without application rather than suspended. That gives individuals more rights, and it is another issue that we are already looking at.

The earnings threshold for the carer support payment will have to align with that for the carers allowance until case transfer is complete, but we continue to look at the responses to the consultation that suggest future changes. The earnings threshold is, of course, very important. I apologise for repeating this, but it is an important point: everything will have to be done in the context of how affordable and sustainable improvements are within the Scottish budget, which is largely fixed.

The work on the minimum income guarantee is very important to the Government. It was very important within the programme for government, and yesterday I had the pleasure of attending the first meeting of that group since I got into post. I heard, for example, from people with direct lived experience in relation to the importance of the Government moving forward with a minimum income guarantee, so we are very keen to look at that.

The First Minister has asked that group to look at what can be done with carers. Of course, it is up to the group to decide its work plan, but I am pleased to say that that was passed yesterday, and there is a lot that could potentially be done within that.

I hope that the group’s final report, when it comes out, can give assistance not just to carers, but on a minimum income guarantee overall. I think, and the Government thinks, that a minimum income guarantee for carers, in particular, would greatly assist them, because we know that there are challenges in that area. We are very keen to look at that, but obviously the report and what is made of it are entirely for that group, which is independent of Government. The group has produced an interim report, but the ask around carers specifically came in after that report was published.

I am happy to bring in Jane Sterry on that issue.

That is a very important point for the agency and Government to consider. Overpayments are an inevitability of the system as it stands, because it is exceptionally complex. In the future, the Government might wish to look at how we can simplify some of the processes, but that will not be done in the short term. We need to get the case transfer right and ensure that we have a system that delivers on some of the priorities that I have mentioned.

In the meantime, I recognise that, when there are overpayments, there is concern among stakeholders about the amount being set at £65, and I reassure the committee—this applies not only to carer support payments but to all the benefits that are dealt with—that the financial circumstances and personal circumstances of individuals, as far as they are known to the agency, are taken into account when the agency assesses overpayments. It is not done automatically and with no communication. That is an important part of the dignity, fairness and respect aspect that goes wider than the carer support payment.

The £65 level is in line with the DWP level, and it is based on the cost of overpayment recovery. In essence, the cost of recovering anything lower than that amount would outweigh the amount that would be recovered. As Social Security Scotland is a relatively new agency, we do not have the data in the agency to determine what the cost of recovery would be. The Government is therefore keen to keep that under review, to see whether changes should be made to the overall policy on payments, and the carer support payment will be included in that.

The agency agreement that we have with the DWP runs out in March 2025, and we have no concerns about that timeframe at the moment. The case transfer begins a few months after our pilot scheme, and the number of case transfers will grow incrementally. We will start small, test everything and ensure that there are no concerns about the transfer and nothing about it that makes it difficult for carers. All carers will have started the transfer journey by the end of 2024 and will have completed it by March 2025. We will start the transfer not long after the pilot scheme, we will begin to scale that up after testing the process, and all carers will have had notification of case transfer by the end of 2024.

Again, that can be an important difference in how we deliver social security in Scotland. It is about recognising that an individual who comes forward and is eligible—in this case, for the carer support payment—could also potentially benefit from further knowledge of what other support is out there. Work has already been undertaken and, from launch, we will continue to finesse our approach on notifications in the award letter and online content signposting carers to what else is available out there. There will be links available as soft stops in the application, perhaps even to help carers who might not be entitled to the benefit but may require further support as a carer. We are also looking at having information on adult carer support plans, young carer statements and so on.

Signposting is very important, but we know that it is only one step and that more can be done. We are keen to further develop the approach as the agency continues its growth, recognising its important place in our communities. I mentioned local delivery, which is important, and, as I mentioned to Roz McCall, that service will have links to local groups.

We will continue to learn. We will continue the national stakeholder engagement with carers stakeholder groups and with the agency to continuously check whether we are getting it right and whether more can be done. That is an added ask of the agency that does not happen in the DWP—it is an additional ask of social security staff. Nevertheless, it is an important ask, because we need to see the carer as an individual rather than as an application form and consider what that individual needs as they move forward.

I hope that that explains some of what we can do online in relation to the application form, even for those people who are not entitled to the benefit, as well as what local delivery can do.

Good morning. As we all recognise, unpaid carers make an immense contribution to our society, but we also know that caring can be challenging for carers’ health and wellbeing and their ability to have a life of their own outside caring.

That is why improving support for unpaid carers is a priority for our social security powers. Despite our fixed budgets and limited powers of devolution, we have transformed social security provision in Scotland, delivering a system that is based on the principles of dignity, fairness and respect.

We launched the carers allowance supplement in 2018 to address the fact that carers allowance was the lowest of all the working-age benefits, and we launched the young carers grant in 2019—two benefits that are unique to Scotland.

The draft regulations before the committee make provision for the carer support payment, which is the 14th benefit provided by Social Security Scotland, replacing carers allowance in Scotland. We have engaged extensively with carers, support organisations and the wider public to design the carer support payment so that it meets the needs of the people who will use it. I am grateful to everyone who contributed their views and to the members of our carers benefits advisory group and the former disability and carers benefits expert advisory group, in particular.

The regulations will remove barriers by extending entitlement to many carers in full-time education who are currently unable to get carers allowance. Once our new benefit is available nationally, it will benefit up to 1,500 more carers. From its launch, the carer support payment will also provide an improved service and signposting, which are designed to help carers to access wider support in social security and beyond.

Carers allowance is the most complex benefit that we have replaced in terms of its links with wider support, particularly the benefits that remain reserved to the UK Government. I am grateful to officials from across the UK for all their hard work in getting the transition right.

The regulations make provision for an initial pilot scheme from November in Dundee city, Perth and Kinross and the Western Isles. As I set out in my letter to the committee, our intention is to extend the benefit to additional local authority areas from spring 2024 and that it will be available nationally from autumn 2024. That will allow us to test the important links with wider support and to deliver continuous improvements to our service. I look forward to coming back to the committee with further regulations in due course, to make provision for the wider roll-out of the benefit.

The regulations also provide for the transfer of the benefits of carers who are already in receipt of carers allowance without any need for them to re-apply, and they ensure that those who are in receipt of carers allowance and the carer support payment continue to get our carers allowance supplement in the same way during the roll-out and transfer periods.

As soon as is practicable after case transfer is complete, we will start to make further improvements, initially by incorporating the carers allowance supplement into carer support payments, so that carers get their extra payments more regularly; extending support when a carer loses the person they care for; and providing extra support for carers with multiple caring roles—a carers additional person payment.

I extend my thanks to the Scottish Commission on Social Security for its formal scrutiny of the draft regulations earlier this year. Its recommendations have been accepted and have strengthened the detail of the regulations that are before us today.

I am grateful for the opportunity to assist the committee in its consideration of the regulations, and I am happy to provide any additional information that the committee might require.