Chamber and committees

Yes, we had the publication of the Ana Stewart report in recent days. The committee takes an interest in that area, so I thank you for that contribution.

Good morning, and welcome to the fourth meeting in 2023 of the Economy and Fair Work Committee. Our first item of business is a decision on taking item 3 in private. Are members content to take that item in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Is work being done to collect data and statistics? You have described how challenging it is and that some of it is not in place yet. The target that we are heading towards is numbers based, so we need to know the baselines to see what progress is being made. Is any work being done by the Scottish Government to collect and collate data in order to have a better understanding of what makes up the disability employment gap, where we are making progress and where more progress needs to be made?

The committee is doing a short piece of work on the disability employment gap. One of the areas that we have identified is data and the information that is available. As you have recognised, progress has been made in closing the gap, which the committee very much welcomes. However, there is evidence, in particular from work that the Fraser of Allander Institute has done, to suggest that progress is concentrated in certain groups and certain types of disability, while other groups are even further away from the workplace than they were. In particular, that work looked at people with learning disabilities. Do you have an understanding of where progress has been made and where further progress needs to be made? Has the data that is needed to inform that understanding been adequately collected?

I suppose I will now add to that difficulty. In the evidence session that we held with Enable Scotland and the Fraser of Allander Institute, they talked about an increase in the number of people with poor mental health—you mentioned Covid and long Covid being in there, as well—and how that was impacting on employment figures. Some of those people are already in work and are then classified as disabled. That might be contributing to the improvement in the number of people in work who have a disability. Do you want to comment on the impact of poor mental health? Has any work been undertaken to assess what impact trends in those areas are having on the overall figures? I think that Susan Ferguson works in that area.

Thank you.

I have a couple of final questions. Written submissions from Enable Scotland and Social Enterprise Scotland have said that the focus has been on providing support to get disabled people into work but that that maybe does not recognise the importance of in-work support and the need to ensure that it is sufficiently funded to enable people to retain employment.

Enable Scotland has pretty good figures on retention, but that has been achieved through one-to-one support from workers who are not overloaded by their case load and who can provide the level of support that people need. Is it recognised as an important part of the strategy to increase employability and decrease the gap that the issue is about not just getting people into jobs—although that will have an impact on the gap—but is also abut retention and keeping people in employment?

We heard yesterday about career progression. It is not just about getting people into employment; it is also about the ambition and aspirations that can be achieved through that. Is that recognised as an important part of what we need to do?

We have heard about the access to work programme which, as you say, is quite well funded. We have heard about difficulties with delays and with the application process, so we will follow that up.

However, my question was not just about that type of support; it was also about the support that we give in Scotland to the third sector and other organisations. Those organisations have talked about the importance of continuity of services. An organisation that has helped someone to gain confidence to apply for a job and has got them through that is often the organisation that is best placed to provide in-work support.

Funds will sometimes be drawn down from the access to work scheme, but at other times that is funded by the Scottish Government or by local authorities. We heard positive feedback about Dundee and Edinburgh councils, which have decided to give some security of funding to organisations to continue that work. That goes back to the postcode lottery question, because it is not happening everywhere.

The access to work programme is important, and people should have more information about it and be able to access it; it should have a higher profile. However, that aside, does the Scottish Government recognise that there is a job to do to support people once they are in employment to secure their employment, and to ensure that organisations are funded to provide that? Do you see that being part of the strategy?

Our next item of business is an evidence session on the disability employment gap. The committee agreed to undertake initial work in this area to identify and address the barriers for disabled people getting into employment. Although we are hearing from the minister today, our call for views remains open for another week, and we encourage people to contribute.

Last week, we heard from the Fraser of Allander Institute, along with Enable Scotland, on structural barriers that disabled people face in accessing employment. Since then, we have been to visit Dovetail Enterprises in Dundee with Enable, and, on Monday, we went to visit the National Autistic Society Scotland to find out about its work in assisting young people into employment.

I welcome Richard Lochhead, the Minister for Just Transition, Employment and Fair Work. He is joined by Scottish Government officials Susan Ferguson, who is the interim deputy director for complex mental health care and dementia, and Lewis Hedge, who is deputy director for fair work and labour market strategy. As always, members and witnesses should keep their questions and answers short and concise. I invite the minister to make a brief opening statement.

We have heard a lot about the need for in-work support. It is good when someone is in employment, but it is important to provide that future support.

I bring in Michelle Thomson, to be followed by Colin Smyth.