Chamber and committees

I thank the witnesses for their really helpful answers so far.

I will touch a bit more on the international evidence. In your written evidence, all of you note what is happening in other countries that have moved to a self-identification model. From those international examples, what can you tell us about the impact of such a move? Specifically, how has it affected trans people in those countries, and how has it affected single-sex spaces? Have you seen any data or evidence that suggests that there has been abuse of the self-ID system in the countries where it has been implemented?

I appreciate that helpful answer. At the moment, anyone who has a gender recognition certificate is protected by the gender recognition aspect of the 2010 act, but that also protects a wider group of people who do not have a gender recognition certificate. People in that broader group have rights that are afforded to people whether or not they have a GRC. What is the legal effect of a GRC? How do you view the relationship between GRCs and the 2010 act? Are you aware of any legal cases about the use of single-sex spaces where the possession of a gender recognition certificate was a factor in determining access or exclusion?

I have a short supplementary question. We have heard evidence that trans people feel that the bill has been one of the most consulted-on pieces of legislation ever and that the length of time for which the process has gone on has not helped the discourse that has been described, for anyone. How do we square that situation with the need to get the additional assurances and legal advice that you have said are required?

Thank you for the evidence that you submitted in advance of the meeting, and for what you have said so far. I also thank you for the work that you have done in the past year, and previously, for the people whom you represent. I acknowledge the significant effort that has gone into your work for LGBT people over the years.

My first question was going to be about the case for change, but you have addressed much of that in setting out your stall, as it were. However, one question remains in that area. Could you tell us a bit more about the hidden costs of applying for a gender recognition certificate?

Not on this theme, convener, but I have a couple of questions on other themes. Would you like me to ask them now or to come back in if there is time?

I am keen to ask about the current landscape of services. I will direct my questions to SAMH and the Money and Mental Health Policy Institute. What is your understanding of the funding environment in which those organisations are working? Has that environment had an impact on their ability to provide mental health and debt support? That also relates to debt advisers’ role in providing mental health support; it works both ways.

As you know, the breathing space mechanism in England is slightly different from our moratorium. Could we and should we extend the moratorium in Scotland to ensure that creditors do not contact people at all and that it lasts for a longer period—for as long as someone is experiencing crisis?

We have had evidence that around 60,000 people got into debt for the first time during the pandemic; what does that tell us about the picture of poverty in Scotland, and what does that mean for how services are delivered and for solutions to the issue? In your submission, you call for a more joined-up data sharing scheme for support services and affordable credit. Could you explain a bit about what happens now and what a more joined-up scheme would look like? Finally, people do not have enough money to pay for essentials. As has already been said, even bankruptcy is a temporary solution. What specific action could we take in Scotland on that and to address the cost of living crisis?

What could we do with the powers that we currently have in Scotland to make the situation better?

Good morning, panel. Thank you for all the evidence that you have provided so far this morning and the information that you shared in advance of the meeting. As I said to the other panel, a lot of what we are hearing is just horrific and I cannot imagine what it is like to have to deliver these services and, indeed, to experience the sort of direct experiences that you have described. It is just horrific.

I have a couple of questions that bring together themes 1 and 3, and I will direct them at Mental Health UK and VOX Scotland. We know—and much of the evidence that we have received acknowledges—that mental health issues and debt issues are related. You have touched on some of this already, but what does that mean for the delivery of services? How can we break the link between mental health issues and debt, and what specific actions can the Government in Scotland take to identify people who will need that additional support?

If it is okay, I would like to direct those questions to Zahra Hussain and Wendy McAuslan.