Chamber and committees

Item 2 is consideration of the Scottish Government’s response to the committee’s pre-budget scrutiny report. I refer members to paper 2. I thank the Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Veterans for his detailed response.

I invite members to share any views they have or follow-up action that they would like the committee to take in response to the cabinet secretary. I will bring in Russell Findlay, Pauline McNeill, and I think that I saw Fulton MacGregor’s hand go up.

Finally, I will hand over to Fulton McGregor, after which I will make a few comments.

Thank you very much, Jamie—that is helpful.

Welcome to the second meeting in 2022 of the Criminal Justice Committee. I have received no apologies this morning. I ask members to ensure that mobile phones are switched to silent and that they wait for the sound engineer to switch on their microphone before speaking.

Our first agenda item is consideration of the Prisons and Young Offenders Institutions (Scotland) Amendment Rules 2021. I refer members to paper 1. Last week, we took evidence on the regulations from the Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Veterans and from the Scottish Prison Service. I think that we all recognise the balance that needs to be struck between a desire to prevent drugs from entering our prisons and, at the same time, protecting the rights of prisoners.

Before I ask whether the committee wishes to report any conclusions to the Parliament, I invite comments from members. Any member who wishes to make a comment should either raise their hand or type an R in the chat function.

I thank all members for their comments, which are balanced, measured and set out our thoughts on the evidence that we have heard and on some of the aspects of the SSI that we would like to monitor and follow-up.

As Russell Findlay alluded to, we need to look at the measures from the perspective of prisoners and prison staff. I was fairly reassured by the evidence that we heard last week, given that the process had been introduced in relatively quick time. However, I feel that we would benefit from getting more information on the practicalities of the process of monitoring and testing mail. It all comes down to ensuring that the practice of monitoring mail that prison officers will be involved in is proportionate.

I highlight that we as a committee have written to the Scottish Prison Service and Police Scotland to seek information on how they respond when psychoactive substances are found. We have also written to the cabinet secretary with additional questions about issues that we identified at last week’s session.

I completely agree with Katy Clark’s comment about the sentimental value of correspondence and the need for careful consideration of how that is handled and managed.

Jamie Greene made a relevant point about other correspondence and communication options. I think that we included some questions on that in some of our follow-up letters. I am more than happy for us to publish our responses. I also note that we will monitor and review the matter going forward.

On that basis, and the basis of members’ comments, are we content that we have no further recommendations to make on the SSI and the evidence that we have heard?

I see that we are agreed. Perfect.

Before we move on, I thank everyone who contributed to our evidence session with written submissions: the Scottish Centre for Crime and Justice Research, Families Outside, and, as Pauline McNeill alluded to, the Miscarriages of Justice Organisation, for their submissions. They were helpful to us so we appreciate their support in that.

Thank you for those follow-up comments.

As Jamie Greene said, we are at the draft budget stage, and I have no doubt that we will return to some of the issues that we feel quite strongly about. As we progress through our work programme, we will have an opportunity to monitor budgetary issues and aspects of the work that we are looking at. When issues come up around a particular topic, we can raise them at that point and in the appropriate way. Do members agree?

I see that no one disagrees.

Finally, I would like to pick up on Russell Findlay’s point about the task force and the recent resignations. I understand where he is coming from with that, but I am not sure that it is necessarily directly a budget issue. However, I am sure that we will have further discussions about that in the context of the issue that Mr Findlay raised.

If we are content not to issue any further correspondence to the cabinet secretary on the budget response that he provided us with, I will bring this agenda item to a close, and thank members for their comments and contributions.

That concludes the public part of the meeting. Our next meeting will be on Wednesday 26 January.

I will hand over to Rona Mackay, and then to Jamie Greene.

I know from looking at the online chat that there are a couple of additional issues that we would be keen to follow up with you, so that would be very much appreciated.

I thank the cabinet secretary and Ms Medhurst for attending. It has been a very useful session.

That concludes the public part of the meeting. Our next meeting will be on Wednesday 19 January. We now move into private.

Thank you, cabinet secretary. Ms Medhurst, would you like to add any additional comments?

I will bring in Pauline McNeill. I ask for succinct questions and answers.