Chamber and committees

A very good morning, and welcome to the 10th meeting of the Criminal Justice Committee in 2023. There are no apologies this morning.

Our first item of business is a decision on whether to take items 3 and 4 on today’s agenda in private. Do members agree to take those items in private?

Members indicated agreement.

I warmly welcome Jim Shields, service manager, and Professor Lorraine Johnstone, consultant forensic and clinical psychologist, St Mary’s Kenmure secure care centre; Wendy Sinclair-Gieben, HM chief inspector of prisons for Scotland; Gerald Michie, governor at His Majesty’s Young Offenders Institution Polmont, and Sue Brookes, interim director for strategy and stakeholder engagement, the Scottish Prison Service; and Alison Bavidge, national director of the Scottish Association of Social Work.

I intend to allow about an hour for this session so, up front, I ask for questions and responses to be as succinct as possible, so that we can get in as many questions as possible.

We move directly to the questions. I will open things up with a general question for each of you. From your organisation’s perspective, will you briefly give a view on the provisions in the bill that set at 18 the cut-off point under which children will not enter the criminal justice system, and on whether that is appropriate? I will go from my left to my right, starting with Sue Brookes.

We are coming up to half past 12. I admire our witnesses’ staying power and patience, and I think that I speak on behalf of members when I say that it has been a really helpful and informative session for the committee. Thank you all very much for attending.

I will let Jim Shields and Lorraine Johnstone come in from the secure care perspective.

I am watching the time because I know that Kate Wallace has to leave. Thank you very much for coming. We will have a quick pause to let you leave the committee room.

We will continue our questioning. Rona Mackay has a question.

Our next item is consideration of evidence on the Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill. I welcome to the meeting Mrs Linda Allan and Kate Wallace, the chief executive officer at Victim Support Scotland. I refer members to papers 1 and 2. I thank both our witnesses for coming to share their views on the Scottish Government’s proposals. I intend to allow about an hour for this session, and I am aware that Kate Wallace needs to leave no later than 10.45 am, as I understand that she is also giving evidence to the Education, Children and Young People Committee this morning—so she has a busy morning ahead.

We will move to questions. I will open things up by asking Kate Wallace to provide the committee with a broad overview of the work that she is involved in with regard to children and young people.

I was just going to bring in Wendy Sinclair-Gieben on the previous question.

If you are quick.

I thank Linda Allan very much for coming along to today’s meeting. We appreciate your time.

There will be a short suspension while we change witnesses.

Will the member take an intervention?