Chamber and committees

I think in that case, it falls to me to engender a little cynicism in the discussion.

We could probably all agree that true sustainability is underpinned by a golden ethical thread, if you like. I suspect that all of you on the panel, as exemplars, will privately be aware of companies that are, frankly, taking advantage of consumer demand for the changes that we all want—the so-called greenwashing. I would appreciate some examples from your SME level—obviously do not name any businesses—of what you would consider to be greenwashing.

It strikes me that government—I am talking about all government across the piece—might choose to engage with larger more established businesses, because that is often where its channels are. However, a lot of the change in the sector is coming from businesses such as yours, which experience very rapid growth and are more fleet of foot. Does that cause a disconnect, in general terms?

Let us have the last words from Michael Cusack and Paul O’Keeffe, who has not had a chance to comment on this topic.

Are you reporting against those measures annually or every three years? Is that just set as an ambition?

The point that I am trying to make is that, given the on-going dispute about no detriment, if the Scottish Government were to discover more crime—even if it were able to, which it is not, in many areas—it would not get the benefit of increased proceeds-of-crime funding, because it would all be offset in the overall budget. Is my understanding correct?

I will pick up on what Ross Greer said about tax avoidance. The issue is not only tax avoidance; it also involves unintended consequences. We know that there are issues around mini umbrella companies, which we have seen in relation to the pandemic. We also know that there are huge issues with Scottish limited partnerships being used for money laundering. My understanding is that none of those reside under anything that would enable the Scottish Government to do anything about them, even though, clearly, from an international perspective, our international brand as a place to do business is affected if people can freely use very loose arrangements such as Scottish limited partnerships.

Can you confirm that my understanding is correct? Can you also say whether there might be other vehicles, even in the form of soft powers, that could be used in relation to things such as Scottish limited partnerships? The Law Society of Scotland has a view on that.

I appreciate that this is straying into justice areas, so you might wish to decline to answer the question. However, it would be useful if you could give us a sense of your thinking.

My last question is about the difference between accountability and responsibility. The Scottish Government is accountable for many of the outcomes in the national performance framework, which is very outcome-driven. Our discussion today has been about the areas where the Scottish Government has responsibility, or those where it has no responsibility, despite having accountability for a range of areas.

There is also the reverse situation in which the UK Government is accountable for many areas but is not subject to scrutiny by the Scottish Government or the Scottish Parliament.

If you were to have a choice about the areas in which responsibility was aligned with accountability, which top three areas would you pick, given the considerable short and long-term economic challenges that we have explored today? Which three things would you like to place on record?

I will follow on from the theme of tax avoidance that Ross Greer highlighted.

I understand that there is a historical dispute going back to devolution of further powers in relation to proceeds of crime and £30 million that it was originally assumed would remain with the Scottish Government but which the UK Government now assumes will go back to it. Is that still the case, and can you give us any insight into the discussions that you are having with the UK Government on the matter? Can you also confirm that, if you moved resources from Police Scotland into dealing with more financial crime, none of the benefit of such a move would accrue to the Scottish Government budget?

Given the focus that there has been on supporting capital investment in early-stage businesses, what progress has there been in managing that with Scottish Enterprise, the SNIB and so on? Where is that at the moment? Can you give some insights?

Following on from that point, have you had any indications of any possible or reasonable rationale as to why the UK Government would not accept the amendment, given your stated concerns about standards? Is there anything that you can share in that regard? If the UK Government is saying that there is no intention of lowering standards, why not simply accept the amendment? Can you clarify the situation?