Official Report 959KB pdf
Education and Skills
Good afternoon. The first item of business this afternoon is portfolio question time, and the portfolio is education and skills.
Your microphone is not on.
Thank you, Mr Kerr. It is on, but I will speak louder. The portfolio this afternoon is education and skills. I remind members that questions 1 and 2 are grouped together, so I shall take any supplementaries on those questions after both have been answered.
University Tuition Fees
To ask the Scottish Government whether it remains committed to free university tuition, in light of the United Kingdom Government’s decision to raise tuition fees for universities in England. (S6O-03957)
It has been a guiding principle of the Scottish Government that higher education in Scotland should be based on the ability to learn and not on the ability to pay. I confirm that the Scottish Government remains resolutely committed to free tuition for Scotland-domiciled students.
I thank the minister for that clear answer. The UK Labour Party promised to reduce tuition fees if Keir Starmer won the election, but, instead, fees have risen, so it is clear that the Scottish National Party is the only party that has got into government and then stuck by its beliefs on free tuition. What impact does free tuition have on Scottish students’ debt levels compared with those in the rest of the UK?
Our policy on free tuition means that Scottish students have the lowest levels of student debt across the UK. Eligible students who study in Scotland do not incur additional loan debt from tuition fees of more than £27,750 over three years, as they would if they were to study in England.
The average student loan debt for Scottish borrowers is £16,680, which is about a third of the debt that is racked up by their English peers. Debt levels in England are likely to rise further as a result of the 3.1 per cent tuition fee increase from the 2025-26 academic year.
University Tuition Fees
To ask the Scottish Government what impact free university tuition has had on young people deciding to stay in Scotland to study for a degree. (S6O-03958)
Record numbers of Scots are attending university. The latest statistics show that more than 32,000 Scottish students started full-time first degrees in Scotland in the 2022-23 academic year. That represents a 27 per cent increase since 2006-07, before the policy on free tuition was introduced.
The Government has committed to widening access to education. Since the establishment of the commission on widening access, there has been a 34 per cent increase in the number of Scottish students from deprived areas entering full-time first-degree courses. Universities and Colleges Admissions Service data shows that record numbers of young Scots secured places at university in the current 2024 UCAS cycle.
As part of our pre-budget scrutiny, in August, the Finance and Public Administration Committee met about 50 students and postgraduate students at the University of Dundee. We asked them what the key issues were in their decision to remain in Scotland after graduating. The number 1 reason was employment opportunities. The second reason was that they had received free tuition, and some clearly felt an obligation to give back. Does the minister agree that retaining young people in Scotland is yet another important reason to ensure that we retain free university tuition here?
I absolutely agree. We recognise the valuable contribution that Scottish graduates make to society. Free tuition supports Scottish students to go to university or college and to gain the skills that they need to drive Scotland’s potential in key sectors of the economy. Statistics that were released in June by the Higher Education Statistics Agency show that the proportion of Scottish university full-time first-degree graduates who move into work or further study sits at 90.4 per cent. However, there is more for us to do to improve understanding among students of all the careers opportunities that their degrees open up for them.
The minister is right to point out the impact that good university education can have, but I will ask him about the impact of the Government’s choice to cut £1.8 million from mental health services in universities. In his answer to my written question, he said that that was in order to
“move to a mainstreamed approach”.—[Written Answers, 27 September 2024; S6W-29856.]
What impact does he think that that will have on the increasing number of people studying in Scotland who are presenting with mental health conditions?
As ever, Pam Duncan-Glancy comes at this from the perspective that the Government faces no financial challenges and that we can simply fund everything. Unfortunately, that is not the case. I draw her attention to the fact that we provided mental health funding across universities and colleges for a three-year period, and we then extended it for a further year to allow the transition to mainstreaming. I absolutely accept the challenges that our universities and colleges face in that regard, but I hope that she will accept the budgetary challenges that the Government faces.
Pupil Behaviour (Teacher Survey)
To ask the Scottish Government what discussions it has had with Fife Council following the publication of an Educational Institute of Scotland survey showing that two thirds of surveyed teachers in Fife were considering leaving teaching as a result of disruptive, challenging or violent pupils. (S6O-03959)
Our schools should be safe learning environments for all. Violence and abusive behaviour towards staff are unacceptable.
The member will be aware that the specific response to those findings is primarily a matter for Fife Council. However, my officials have raised the survey data with Fife Council directly, and I am advised that the council has been working constructively with the EIS locally to address the concerns.
The Government is committed to providing direction at a national level, too. In August, we published our national action plan on relationships and behaviour in schools, to which the EIS contributed. Yesterday, we launched updated guidance called “Respect for All”.
This week, I met EIS Fife and Unison Fife, which raised serious concerns about the lack of response and action. They highlighted the level of additional support needs in Fife that are not being addressed, and they said that more pupil support assistants and additional support teachers, as well as improved pupil support services, are needed. In many primary schools across Fife, class sizes are far too large. When will the cabinet secretary move beyond plans and guidance and start to look at what resources are needed to address the issues that trade unions are rightly highlighting?
I thank Mr Rowley for raising a really important point. He knows that, before I was elected in 2016, I was an employee of Fife Council, as a teacher, so I recognise some of the challenges.
I have details of the action that the local authority has committed to, which my officials have shared with me, and I would be more than happy to share that information with Mr Rowley. If he would like me to meet him and the EIS locally, I would be more than happy to engage with them on those issues.
Mr Rowley talked about resourcing challenges. It is worth putting on the record that the Government is spending record levels on additional support needs in this financial year and that we spent £926 million in the previous financial year alone. That has allowed local authorities, including Fife Council, to increase the number of pupil support assistants by 725 in the past year, and it is a key reason why the Government is so committed to protecting and maintaining teacher numbers. I must observe that, in the past year, Fife Council’s teacher numbers have reduced, despite that additionality coming from the Scottish Government.
We have to work with local authorities on improvements to Scottish education and on all the issues that Mr Rowley has raised, but I recognise that there are joint responsibilities in that regard. With the budget approaching, I am sure that Mr Rowley will be making some of those points in his negotiations with his party’s leadership. I would be more than happy to meet him to discuss what those improvements might be, recognising the need for the protection of education budgets. That has been the Government’s approach over many years.
Education (Additional Support Needs)
To ask the Scottish Government whether it will provide an update on the progress being made to improve the educational experiences of children and young people with additional support needs in school settings. (S6O-03960)
Scotland’s approach to supporting children and young people with their learning has inclusion at its heart. That is why, last week, I published the third additional support for learning progress report. It sets out the progress that was made between November 2022 and June 2024 towards delivery of the actions that were set out in the ASL action plan, and it was developed in partnership with the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities and the ASL project board. To complement the progress report, an updated ASL action plan was also published, outlining the steps that we are taking to meet the recommendations that are set out in the ASL review.
I know that the cabinet secretary appreciates that there has been an increase in the number of pupils who are recognised as having neurodivergent needs but who do not yet have a diagnosis. She also appreciates that effective relationships between parents, carers and schools are paramount in ensuring that there are no unnecessary pressures on families or associated issues that act as barriers to learning. Does the cabinet secretary agree that the use of team around the child meetings can be essential in identifying much-needed supports while a diagnosis is being sought?
I absolutely agree. Maintaining positive relationships between parents, carers and schools and taking a multi-agency approach are critical in ensuring positive outcomes for our children and young people, particularly those with additional support needs.
Under the ASL framework, a formal diagnosis or identification is not required for a child or a young person to receive appropriate support with their learning. However, while any diagnosis of additional support needs is being considered, our getting it right for every child policy promotes a holistic and rights-based approach, which is hugely important. The member mentioned the team around the child approach, which I know has been proven to work in providing additionality and joining up services. Particularly following the pandemic, we need to be mindful of the role of other services in providing support to our children and young people, who are not necessarily always in an educational space.
Despite the fact that twice as many pupils now need support, the number of ASN teachers has decreased by 12 per cent. In the capital, there are 166 ASN teachers, which gives a pupil to teacher ratio of 145 pupils per ASN teacher. What is the cabinet secretary’s expectation of the ASL review in relation to the ASN pupil to teacher ratio in Scottish schools?
I do not think that the ASL update mentions the pupil to teacher ratio in that specific detail. However, across these islands, Scotland has the lowest pupil to teacher ratio, at 13 to 2. As I said in my response to Mr Rowley, we have increased the number of pupil support assistants by 725 in the past year alone as a result of additionality from the Scottish Government.
Miles Briggs raises an important point about the role of specialists. I am mindful of that issue and of how we can better facilitate support for schools, not just from specialist teachers but from other professionals, such as educational psychologists and speech and language therapists.
In relation to upcoming budget negotiations, I am sure that parties around the Parliament will be considering such issues, and I would be more than happy to sit down with Mr Briggs if he has proposals to that end.
Special Schools (Funding)
To ask the Scottish Government, in light of reports that approximately 1,200 applications for places in special schools were refused, whether it will increase funding and resources to ensure that all children requiring specialised support can access appropriate education without placing any additional pressure on families. (S6O-03961)
The Scottish Government investment in additional support needs has reached a record high of £926 million in 2022-23, helping to address growing demand in that area. In the past year alone, that additionality has supported the employment of an extra 725 pupil support assistants in local authorities across the country. It is for local authorities to determine the most appropriate educational provision for children and young people with additional support needs.
Through its freedom of information inquiries, The Scotsman ascertained that 1,200 applications were rejected, including those of 200 children who were turned away from Glasgow City Council due to a lack of resource. That comes as the number of special schools has sharply fallen from 190 in 2006 down to just 107 last year. The Education, Children and Young People Committee recently made its position clear, highlighting the urgent need for improved teacher training and better investment in specialist staff. Does the Scottish National Party Government acknowledge those failures?
The member follows a similar line of questioning to that of Mr Briggs in his supplementary question, so I have given some of my response to his question in that regard.
However, I want to touch on teacher training. One of the issues that the committee raised with me was the predominance of support for initial teacher education and how we can be certain that all trainee teachers are getting the level of support that they need in relation to additional support needs. My response to that in the ASL action plan update was to commit to us surveying and working with initial teacher education institutions to consider the provision of support for our teachers in that initial year, which will look slightly different depending on whether they are undertaking the postgraduate degree or the four-year bachelor of education degree. It is important that we look at teacher training and ensure that there is consistency across the piece.
These young people are part of our system—they are not an add-on any more. In the schools that I visit now, sometimes more than 50 per cent of the pupil population has an additional support need. Part of the change that I should identify has been the shift in the way in which we measure additional support needs. That change in 2010 has meant that we have had an increase in the numbers. It was the right thing to do, but we should reflect that we need to look again at how we resource and provide support.
I have put on the record today a number of the—
Cabinet secretary, I need to bring your response to a close, because I need to call the next MSP to ask their question. Clare Haughey has a supplementary.
Will the cabinet secretary set out what support the Scottish Government has already put in place for ASL?
A range of actions have been carried out to date. I can highlight that we have established the success looks different awards to co-create and collaborate with children and young people and their families. Work has also begun to establish parent groups with local authorities of those who have children with additional support needs to achieve that objective.
Professional learning opportunities for our teaching and support staff continue to be a priority. Although we know that there is more than one approach to addressing the issue of staff training, we remain committed to exploring options regarding initial teacher education, as well as taking further steps to improve the support that is available for teachers in other areas.
Teacher Employment
To ask the Scottish Government what information it holds on how many of last year’s newly qualified teachers have a permanent contract to teach in a Scottish school. (S6O-03962)
In Scotland, we have the most teachers per pupil in the United Kingdom and 876 newly qualified teachers moved into permanent contracts last year. That includes full-time and part-time permanent contracts.
As the member will know, teacher employment is a matter for local authorities as employers. However, this Government values our teachers, and we are doing everything possible to help maximise the number of teaching jobs that are available, including permanent posts. As part of that, we are providing £145.5 million to local authorities to protect teacher numbers. We also invest in a policy of free tuition, we fully fund the postgraduate qualification and we pay for the first year of probation.
Although we cannot direct teachers where to work, it is important to note that teacher vacancies arise across Scotland throughout the academic year.
I hope that the cabinet secretary has a firm focus on the issue, because the reality is that four out of five post-probation teachers do not have a permanent contract and that a third of newly qualified teachers are leaving the profession. That is nothing short of a shocking waste of talent and a dismal failure of workforce planning. Make no mistake—that is down to the cabinet secretary. There is no point in protecting the number of teachers if teachers do not have permanent jobs. Will she insist that the £145.5 million of additional funding that she is withholding is used to create permanent jobs?
The member raises a pertinent point, and I assure him that I am certainly very focused on it at the current time. He will know that I have taken action not to pay out that money, as has happened in previous years, when we have seen local authorities be in receipt of funding and cut teacher numbers at the same time. I do not think that that is a sustainable position for any Government to defend.
On recruitment and retention, I am focused on three key challenges. The first relates to our primary teachers. We know that a number of primary teachers are currently unable to secure permanent posts, which is the issue that the member rightly raises. I want to find some quick solutions to try to deliver on some of the member’s aspirations. We are looking at some innovative approaches. For example, we are encouraging primary teachers to gain an additional qualification to become an additional support needs specialist, if they would like to or would consider that option. That has the additional benefit of supporting the growing number of children with ASN, as we have heard this afternoon.
The second relates to secondary level, where there are challenges in training and recruiting enough teachers, particularly in certain hard-to-fill subjects.
I am conscious of time, Presiding Officer. I would like to give the member a substantive answer, so it might be opportune for me to write to him directly to give him a fulsome update on the three challenges that I am focused on, which relate to primary teachers and issues around permanency, secondary teachers and the gaps in subject areas, and rural and remote areas, where we are having challenges in terms of—
Thank you, cabinet secretary.
I will write to the member.
I have a number of members wishing to ask supplementary questions, and we need to move to those, to ensure that members get their opportunities.
I know of newly qualified teachers who can spend seven years without a permanent contract. There is intermittent employment and there are short-term contracts. That is not acceptable. Why is the Government continuing to train new teachers when it cannot and will not deliver on its promise of 3,500 extra teachers?
Mr Rennie raised that issue in the debate that we had not two weeks ago, I think, and he will recall that I played back to him the experience of one of his constituents who had been on short-term contracts in Fife Council for a number of years. I do not think that that is an optimal situation, and it is not one that I would support. Some of the challenge relates to where the employment of teachers rests, and that is the responsibility of local authorities.
I have spoken to the additionality that the Scottish Government provides to support trainee teachers. The Government meets the huge expense of tuition fees. We also fully fund the postgraduate year and the probation year. A lot of funding comes from central Government to support teachers into employment.
The challenge comes when local authority employment practices vary up and down the country. It is imperative that we work with the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities to arrive at a situation—I see Willie Rennie shaking his head at me, but that is the current reality. We need to work with COSLA to ensure that there is parity across the country in how our initial teachers enter the workforce. At the current time, there is a variety of approaches to initial teacher employment, and that needs to change in the future, particularly because of the additionality that the Government is providing.
I call Bill Kidd, who has a supplementary question.
Thank you, Presiding Officer, but the excellent answer that has just been given covers my question. [Laughter.]
Thank you, Mr Kidd. We move to the next question.
Teacher Numbers and Need (Monitoring)
To ask the Scottish Government how it collaborates with local authorities to monitor teacher numbers and staffing needs across council areas. (S6O-03963)
The Scottish Government undertakes an annual collection of data from local authorities on teacher numbers and characteristics, which is published as part of the summary statistics for schools in Scotland. That information is used to monitor teacher numbers nationally and by local authority area and to inform teacher workforce planning, which sets initial intake targets for programmes for initial teacher education through the work of the teacher workforce planning advisory group. The Scottish Government uses that data as the basis for discussions with local authorities on teacher numbers and need.
Scotland’s local authorities clearly have a vital role to play in this area. Will the cabinet secretary set out what actions the Scottish Government is taking to improve the recruitment and retention of teachers in Scotland?
Colin Beattie is absolutely right. Our local authorities have a key role to play, which is the point that I was making to Willie Rennie in my previous answer.
The strategic board for teacher education, which is made up of a range of key education stakeholders, is looking in detail at issues around the recruitment and retention of teachers in Scotland. That includes geographical and subject-specific issues, as well as how we can increase diversity within the profession and improve support for early-career teachers who need it. The board is considering how we can encourage more people into teaching, especially in subjects that we know are particularly challenging to fill, such as computing science and modern languages.
The board is progressing innovative work to support teacher education and development throughout their careers, which, in the longer term, has the potential to increase teacher recruitment and retention.
Living Costs Support (Part-time Disabled Students)
To ask the Scottish Government what consideration has been given to improving the living costs support available to part-time disabled students. (S6O-03964)
The Scottish Government has made a commitment to undertake a review of student support for part-time and distance-learning students. All issues impacting on part-time students will be given careful consideration as part of that review. As an initial step, we have opened up living costs support to disabled students who are studying full-time distance learning courses and who are unable to study campus-based courses because of their disability.
As the minister knows, full-time disabled students get living costs support, but many disabled students study part time. For example, the Open University says that 28 per cent of its disabled students study part time, and part-time students do not get the same levels of support. Does the minister agree that, for reasons of equality and fairness, there is a strong case for part-time disabled students getting parity and increased access to living costs?
Although part-time students cannot receive living costs via bursaries or loans, they can access the disabled students allowance via the Students Awards Agency Scotland if they study to at least 50 per cent intensity of full-time equivalent courses. That extends to those studying via distance learning up to and including course credits leading to a degree.
We will always be asked to go further, and we aspire to do the best that we can by our students within the constraints of affordability. The review that I referenced will explore all asks and all options, while recognising the financial challenge, which will almost certainly mean that an incremental approach will be necessary.
We should be endeavouring to improve the supports that are available to disabled students throughout their time in higher education. What steps is the Scottish Government already taking to ensure that students with additional support needs are encouraged to remain in education without compromising access to critical financial support?
The Government is committed to ensuring that all students with a disability, a long-term medical condition or additional support needs are able to access higher education and are fully supported throughout their studies. As an initial step, as I indicated earlier, we have opened up living cost support to disabled students who are studying full-time distance learning courses and who are unable to study campus-based courses because of their disability.
The Equality Act 2010 places a specific duty on colleges and universities to make reasonable adjustments to ensure that disabled students can access education and any related services.
That concludes portfolio question time. If members who wish to move to the front bench do so quickly, that will enable us to move straight on to the next item of business.
Previous
First Minister’s Question TimeNext
Ministerial Events