Chamber and committees

The principle is important, but I am not clear what the options might be for the Government to take that forward as a meaningful piece of work.

The Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Act 2019 included a requirement to establish a citizens assembly. I do not think that there would be a need for more legislation to revisit a citizens assembly on climate. I see parallels with this issue. Yes, one way forward would be to bootstrap it and put it into legislation, but I am looking for leadership from the Scottish Government, whatever that looks like, whether that is put into legislation or it is a non-legislative measure.

Graham Simpson’s amendments 2 and 3 show the inevitable tension between Maurice Golden and Graham Simpson on turbocharging co-design. We must recognise that we have to take people with us: we have to take businesses and communities with us. A lot of careful work was done in the early years, right the way through to the implementation of the deposit return scheme. Members who have sat on this committee and looked at the evidence, heard about the work of Lorna Slater and scrutinised Circularity Scotland and others will recognise that that model was being developed and came very close to being implemented. That emphasises for me the importance of co-design. It is important.

I think that the Government is pursuing co-design in a meaningful way right now, and to simply put an arbitrary timescale on the development of a circular economy strategy, just for the sake of it, would not be a good way forward. We need work to progress at pace on all the areas in the circular economy strategy, but that will take some time, and just putting “six months” or “1 year” on it, as in the amendments, is a little churlish. It underestimates the depth of the work that is needed with stakeholders to work this through and the depth of work that was put in place for the deposit return scheme.

Perhaps the minister is sensing concerns across the committee that, despite action in sectors such as construction having been identified years ago as being important, Governments have not followed that through into waste route maps and programmes of work. Perhaps she is sensing frustration across the committee that despite construction being an area of significant resource use with a significant impact when it comes to climate change, there is a concern that the Government as a whole has not moved effectively to prioritise it. Clearly, a discussion is to be had between now and stage 3 on what action from the whole Government looks like, and what reassurances the Government can give committee members, across parties, that such action will follow.

I recognise that the minister is very new in post.

Will Maurice Golden confirm that the bill does not need new powers for the development of refillables and refillable schemes in Scotland? As I understand it, those powers are in the Environment Act 2021. Is that not right? We therefore do not need more legislation. However, I accept his desire for more refillable schemes to come forward.

Hang on a minute—let me finish the sentence.

It will take more than six months to develop a strategy around construction and for the strategy to move into sectors in which there perhaps has not been that focus or development over time. I will leave my comments there.

I accept that Graham Simpson wants to put other options on the table, but we have also heard in the debate that there are sectors, such as construction, in which there has not been enough significant progress. To be honest, that will take time. It will take more than six months to—

I will speak first about amendments 182 and 186, which address the use of key minerals, which are sometimes called transition minerals, in our transition towards green energy. Members will be aware of many of the social and environmental impacts of minerals such as lithium, cobalt, nickel, iron ore and copper, which are all critical to the development of renewable energy and of battery systems. I acknowledge that the renewable energy industry is doing increasingly impressive work on circularity and on addressing the impact of transition minerals, but we need to go further, because the roll-out of renewable energy will continue apace and the limitations of those minerals will not go away. We need a focus and a plan from Government to drive that.

I acknowledge that Scotland currently does not have a strategy for the renewable energy sector for sourcing those minerals and that the UK has a critical minerals strategy. Although there is an acknowledgement in the draft energy strategy of the role of those minerals, there is not exactly a plan at the moment that will ensure that their availability and the environmental and social impacts of their use will be addressed.

Amendments 182 and 186 would require the circular economy strategy to include improvement plans for transition minerals for the energy sector. That would promote a more responsible and resilient approach to securing those essential resources. I hope that the Government will be open to working with me on a way forward on that.

Amendment 183 is linked to amendment 191, which we will come to later. It addresses concerns from Scottish Environment LINK that ministers need to give priority to the most damaging materials that are circulating in the economy. I have resisted putting in a specific list of those materials, because I think that that will change over time. However, members will, obviously, be aware of some of the more problematic materials at the moment, such as PFAS—perfluoroalkyl and polyfluoroalkyl substances—or forever chemicals, which we see in packaging. Flame retardants in mattresses and upholstered furniture are a particular problem at the moment.

Amendment 183 would add in section 1(3) a requirement for ministers, in having regard to processes for the design and distribution of products, to focus in on particular minerals that are the most harmful and polluting over their life cycle. It would be up to Government to determine what the most problematic materials are.

I will in a second.

I would also point to the climate package that was announced a couple of weeks ago. The Scottish Government’s intention is to drive forward citizens panels, citizens assemblies and participative democracy in that space. Consumption is a very important part of our climate impact, so I hope that some kind of initiative and leadership can be shown on that.

That is useful to know. Are we hitting the buffers in that regard now, or are you anticipating that there will be problems with ferries being taken off routes in the next year or two?

When reflecting on Stephen Kelly’s comments, I was thinking in particular about Cairnryan. What practical changes might be needed in how Cairnryan operates its facilities? I note that there will be no border at Cairnryan, but, given where we are with border checks and agreements, what might need to change to meet your members’ needs at Cairnryan in the future?

It is useful for the committee to hear such practical, real-world concerns.