Chamber and committees

David Malcolm, do you want to comment on that before I bring in Sharon Dowey?

I have a question about whistleblowers. In the past, the committee has done quite a bit of work on mental health and policing, in the context of both the growing demand on police officers from people with poor mental health and the toll that the job of policing takes on officers and staff. SIPR has been particularly active in that area. We know the toll that a misconduct or disciplinary process can take on everybody involved.

I am interested in the position for whistleblowers. Do the bill’s provisions provide enough support for whistleblowers? If they do not, what else should be included in the bill to address the issue? For example, should there be an independent organisation for whistleblowers in Police Scotland and the SPA? If so, should that organisation potentially be the PIRC?

I will bring in Dr Lennon first and put her on the spot.

Thank you. That is very clear. Perhaps the wording of the bill has to allow for that interaction between the duty of candour and the points about self-incrimination that you have set out.

I go to David Malcolm to pick up the same question.

Thank you, that has given us a helpful bit of background.

Genevieve Lennon, the point about monitoring was touched on in the SIPR submission. It is all very well to have a code of ethics that looks nice and shiny and new, but what is important is the application of the code of ethics and ensuring that its effectiveness continues as, for example, new officers come in, policing functions change and so on. Can you expand on what was in your submission on that point?

Thank you for that. I understand what you are saying—you have set things out very clearly. The evidence that we have had so far suggests that there is support for a duty of candour, and that it perhaps reflects a robust approach to dealing with complaints and conduct issues, and transparency. Given what you have said, would the establishment of a duty of candour necessarily change what you have described? You do not see that there is an issue. I want to be clear about why a duty of candour would necessarily change that.

Okay. Thank you very much.

I open it up to questions from members. I will bring in Katy Clark and then Russell Findlay.

Okay, and then I will bring in Fulton MacGregor.

That is a helpful point.

Kate, this is a big question but, given that Victim Support Scotland is such a front-facing organisation, I am interested in hearing your views on your experience of engaging with the PIRC.

Okay. I am going to pull the evidence session to a close. Thank you all for joining us and for your time. It has been a really interesting session.

We will have a short suspension to allow a changeover of witnesses.

That is a helpful clarification.

This has been an interesting session, and we have covered quite a lot. Thank you for coming along today; we appreciate your time.

That concludes the public part of our meeting, and we will now move into private session.